That’s all.
EDIT: Thank you all for detailing your experience with, and hatred for, this miserable product. Your display of solidarity is inspiring. Now, say it with me:
Fuck Microsoft
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Yes. Typical MS corporate BS. Take “inspiration” from slack and zoom, make it great to steal the market, then make it worse and more expensive every once and a while.
I don’t mind teams for chatting or meetings but I hate sharepoint and the Teams file “structure” with a passion.
I’m so tired of web engine based apps
Microsoft OneDrive is the maggots in the dog shit
There shouldn’t be worms in the poop of a healthy dog. This analogy just keeps getting better and more accurate.
Maggots aren’t worms.
Oooh, I hate it so bad…… I used to click “Save” and my word document would ask to save in the only folder I save ALL my documents in. Change the name, save, so easy!
Now it asks if I want to save to OneDrive… Fuck No Mr Paperclip! I want it in the folder I always use and don’t want to have to select “Other” then dig through screens to select the thing I use every time!
Hit F12 to bypass the bs.
Note to self….
On Mac, I would use Keyboard Maestro to try to automate that. I think AutoHotkey can do the same kind of thing on Windows?
So annoying. The OneDrive documents folder masquerading as your actual docs folder. Diabolical.
What’s worse is when I need to upload the doc to a website the OneDrive folder is nowhere to be found.
Tricksy onedrives
The pain all need to go through using Windows 11 and Outlook.
Onedrive is pretty ok, other than being annoying. A company I worked for was acquired by another company that had their own cloud storage product. After the acquisition, they forced us to migrate from onedrive to their product. It was so bad… Files would constantly corrupt and disappear, the speed was terrible, trying to share files didn’t work half the time, when sharing folders the people you shared with wouldn’t see all the files in the folder. They also limited our storage from 1TB to 25GB making it pretty useless for storing builds of our product or trying to share VMs.
And the worst part is that they also closed our SMB network share to force us to use that piece of shit.
After that experience, I will never complain about Onedrive again.
Haha oh man that sounds infuriating. Of course it could be worse, but def could be better
A faithful to Microsoft… But what can all of us do? We bow to Microsoft
I mean, with winter coming in, and universities not bothering to heat the building, teams turning my potato work laptop into a furnace is the only thing keeping us warm this winter…
Serious question - is their long term strategy bad optimisation to sell hardware? Do they have shares in intel or something?!?
That’s all.
There’s more: microsoft outlook is garbage
The new outlook has exceeded “garbage” and gone all the way to dumpster fire. It sometimes takes upwards of 15, 30 seconds to open an email. The new auto formatting is a hindrance to be overcome by tricking it to act how you want. Trying to schedule an event across timezones shits the bed half the time, resulting in improper meeting times being sent out. Absolute failure.
New Outlook also doesn’t support Really Simple Syndication, which I used a lot with the Old Outlook.
So back to old Outlook I go.
My CISO has all but said he’s going to prevent any auto-rollout of that shit because it breaks decades of user training and TRUNCATES THE FRONT OF THE URL, NOT THE BACK LIKE ANY SENSIBLE APPLICATION.
Like, let’s make it so Steve in accounting can’t see that the login link he wants to click is actually haxxor.com instead of bank.com, makes perfect fucking sense.
Wait, really? I’ve found the new outlook opens emails faster than the old one, especially the HTML-heavy ones that my work loves to send me.
The refactor to the rules UI is really nice too, the old one was so crusty. Can’t comment on the timezone issue though.
I’ve been told the extended time to open is related to how big the outlook database is, I average 200 emails received a day with various alerts and notifications from internal tools and it cripples new outlook in about a week if I’m not diligent with keeping folders cleaned out/emails deleted. This volume wasn’t a issue before I switched.
Ah so your issue is, let me see here… Ah, actually using Outlook like a normal user.
I’ve tried switching to Thunderbird myself but it doesn’t support Office 365 without a third party service. So I feel stuck with Outlook.
Ah, actually using Outlook like a normal user.
Ha, right? I’m keeping my fingers crossed there is some executive at MS raging and it will get resolved before they force everyone off the legacy version. Surely there are people inside their organization with tons more traffic than I see.
There’s probably a microsoft engineer out there somewhere sitting in a cubical who has the solution already written and tested and they just can’t figure out how to send it to their boss. They’ve tried outlook, teams, github, skype, and even one drive but they’re all so broken that it may just be faster to print the code out and mail it.
I accidentally switched to it and it dropped all my non-MS mailboxes. Then when I immediately switched back it had the gall to ask me why.
I will give respect where due: I like the sweep button. It’s handy for me personally, as someone who is on several email lists that are public-facing. That’s about it.
Every attempt to help me automatically is a pain. Like most things in this vein it never learns what you’re trying to do, only what they would do in a given scenario that’s vaguely like ours.
I think there’s tons of things I love for it to do for me automatically - there’s all sorts of quality of life features that I only notice when they change it, usually without bothering to tell me. And now, my muscle memory is leading to unexpected behavior, and it’ll take me weeks to learn to stop doing that, and a few more months of training to learn the new muscle memory as I relapse at all the worst times
Some of it is straight up better, some of it is great new capabilities, but in the last few years? All that comes to mind is I thought it was pretty cool they added auto responses, even if I never actually use them. Doesn’t change existing behavior, just adds a new option that’s not in the way
But then the auto complete - I hate it so much. And I love auto complete - except it’s the fucking opposite behavior of every IDE out there, including Microsoft’s! I can’t even unlearn it, because it’s a core part of my workflow!
So now, I constantly have to delete things I never wanted to say, and I delete the things I thought sounded good.
I like new features and the computer doing things for me automagically… But I’d rather them to just stop at this point
I’ll die on the hill that classic outlook is far better than Gmail and similar web interfaces for email especially if you have long threads or lots of emails.
Also somehow Google’s email search sucks so bad compared to searching in outlook.
Thunderbird <3
It’s actually disturbing that Thunderbird is the only good smtp/imap client available and it’s not receiving that much funding.
I agree. The old Outlook was snappy and dense of information. The new Outlook is just a fucking web page.
If I’m being honest the only Microsoft product I actually like is Excel.
They’re doing their best to “improve” excel too… I can’t understand how their AI generated cell fill is worse than the old approach.
Ever try finding an old email by sender. Lol, good luck
Microsoft Teams isn’t all bad! For example, it bogged down my work computer so much at start up that I would basically get an extra break.
It temporarily deletes my meetings just before they happen, so that I don’t have to attend them!
Of course, when I open it later, the meetings are restored, with the original date, and no trace of the deletion. So not attending them is quite hard to explain to others. But it does save me from attending!
Just do in what I do. Don’t join meetings most of the time. That way when you do it is noteworthy to the meeting stakeholder.
Yeah sure my manglers through the years try to have ‘the talk’ but after awhile of training them via sheer apathy they shut the fuck up.
I solve complex problems, get my tasks done, I’m independent and I stay busy because I’ll get bored. Most meetings could just be an email. There’s no real collaboration except managers or scrum masters asking what your blockers are but not actually doing anything about it. If I think the meeting will be a waste of my time I just don’t show up.
Take a print
The one problem with that is that I need to know I’m not being told about a meeting to take a print.
The the screen recording always on lol
Oh, nice, Windows 11 will fix Teams!
fuxk yea I get like an extra 30 mins a day at leastttt
Hahaha!
Fuckin epic!
You put more effort into this post than M$ did to their product
I mean , works for me. You know what is complete bullshit?
SKYPE. Using that in a work environment is a nightmare
Microsoft
Teamsis dog shitThat’s all.
Bill Gates is en route to your location
Oh dear god, no, what have I done
Bill Gates in this episode looks like he’d have nanomachines
Such a brave opinion on Lemmy you have balls if steel sir.
If steel what?
Your mother
😮
I don’t understand reacting like this. Do you disagree? Do you think only people with opinions that aren’t popular on whatever place they are should share them? Should no one ever say what many others are thinking?
Yes
My company has teams and slack and IT wants to switch to all teams. The thread where they announced this had to be locked. :D I don’t know how a trillion dollar company can’t get this right. Worst yet the bundle that shit with everything and overworked IT depts pick it by default.
Since I have not seen anyone mention this problem yet: Teams doesn’t let you mute other people in a call for yourself. Obviously also no volume control per person. Imagine sitting next to your coworker in a teams meeting and having to deal with hearing them twice with like 20 ms delay. Awful.
What blows my mind is MS fucking bought Skype and somehow Teams still can’t handle video calls correctly. The actual fuck did they do with that acquisition?
Skype used to be peer to peer. Your call went from you to your friend (whomever). Microsoft decided that they couldn’t mitm that setup to scrape data; so, soon after they acquired Skype, they made all calls go through their servers.
Then they tried to make Skype make more money, since those servers aren’t free. Then they made teams and copied half the code into that, and cludged the rest to make it hold together.
In mean aside from the fact that almost all of that story is completely wrong, it’s a good story.
Source: Used to work at Microsoft and worked a lot with people from the Skype team.
What is the real story?
Skype made the call negotiation go through a central server (as does all systems nowadays). Skype was originally built on Kazaa technology to punch through firewalls without a central coordinator and that’s what Microsoft removed. They didn’t remove it to track the calling but to enable larger group calls on weaker devices which required video mixing on a central system rather than peer to peer call (where weaker peers couldn’t decode that many video streams). Calls up to 4 are still routed peer to peer if the backend can find routes through all firewalls.
Very very little of Skype was in the new Teams if anything. Teams was a rewrap of Communicator calling tech and was a response to Slack. The real time chatting had nothing to do with Skype either.
Skype lingered in Microsoft for a couple of reasons; Microsoft was crap at acquiring businesses back then, thinking that a hands off approach was best. It meant Skype never really became a proper Microsoft team - they still felt and acted like Skype employees and they didn’t manage to affect Redmond very well. Being acquired is super hard especially when almost all of the bigger business was in a different time zone and a different culture.
I was at a leadership development workshop with a tonne of Skype leaders about 10 years ago. They were still feeling incredibly frustrated and not understanding what was expected of them. It was a botched acquisition and the fault was on both sides.
So Teams calls of 1-4 people can send traffic direct peer-to-peer if they’re on the same LAN right?
Do all calls of 5+ users stay centrally hosted on the cloud? These are the kinds of things that MS should document and make easily available for IT and firewall admins. Finding info on Teams ports wasn’t easy in my experience.You’re way outside my scope of knowledge - I know a bit about the decisions they took 10 years, and not very much on what is happening today. I would imagine some of these limits are configurable and dynamic. I really don’t know.
They probably used Chat-GPT which at the time…
Ok Mr Chat I need to rewrite the Skype code to look more like what we have been doing at Microsoft…
Oh my! It keeps crashing my PC, can you do a little less crash and more icons and shit?
Oh, it crashed my PC once more. How about this time no crash?
Dude, I said no crash! But nice graphics! Can you make the people icons at least 25% of the total screen real estate? And can you also hide the full screen icon into at least half an hour of clicks? Yeah make it real hidden!
Fantastic work on the full screen thing! Could you not make it like anything Microsoft has made before up to the point where it can actually run?
Good job at sending all my information to random strangers! Many points for that! And the icons! Soo big and beautiful! Thanks Chat-GPT! Bill! We’re ready to release!
…
When do you think teams came out?
I’ve been using teams for 3 or 4 years before the pandemic… So maybe around 2015? I gotta Google check that. But then before it was called teams it was called Skype. I recall the thing had a shitty transition to becoming teams.
Looks like the transition was around 2016 from Skype to teams but Skype has been around since 2003.
You should write a post sometime about what you know from the internals of Skype. I would read it.
Skype is fading fast. Thank God. Discord is already an internet standard.
Replacing garbage with sewer water. Not exactly an improvement.
And at least garbage let you make international calls with the money you put into it. Nitro-saturated sewer water gives you what—a bit of extra bandwidth utilization, 2 free tokens to prove you’re above the poverty line, and discounts on paid cosmetics?
How the fuck did they let motherfucking Zoom take over. The video-call equivalent of “Googling” something was to “Skype.” When Covid hit, Microsoft screwed the pooch horribly.
My sister is super high ranking at Microsoft, and when she calls the family, she uses Zoom.
I don’t see “screwed the pooch” used much but it always is funny to me.
Well, I’m a unix guy for 30 years and hated M$ bill gates blablabla and forced to use windows at work etc. Teams was somewhat bad at the beginning, especially start of covid pandemic , I’m using Teams multiple times daily for ~5 years now. But since ~1 year it handles video call pretty nicely, 20+ feeds, share screens, whiteboard, etc. it’s pretty stable at least, don’t crash anymore, and we can have multiple accounts. It took times to reach this state I agree…
In the past two years, I have had horrible issues where it decides that I’m not allowed to join the call because I have a Teams account logged into a different organization, that it won’t let me log out of. An issue where Microsoft servers just time out if you have ipv6 enabled, etc.
Don’t get me started on Skype for Business. It’s still around.
Oh yeah, that multiple organizations things absolutely fuuuucks me since I’m adjunct at multiple universities/colleges. It keeps trying to default me to a place I don’t even work at anymore and somehow still refuses to let me leave it without reinstalling Windows (which I won’t do as I’ll be moving to Linux full time once I do).
Teams are losing parts of text chat conversations for me. Not sure if that’s issue of their PWA on Linux or just an issue in general…
PWA in Linux is unusable yep, with FF or Edge, super buggy.
I’m using Teams in Windows, I have a software KVM to move between my Linux PC and work windows laptop
I always say that the only reason they keep Skype alive is to make Teams appear good
The core of what made Skype great was made by a team of engineers in Estonia. Once it got acquired most of those people left the company. Many of them ended up at Twilio.
Fuck Microsoft. But first, Fuck Google, Fuck Amazon, Fuck Facebook. I am sure I could think of a few more that are worse than Microsoft, as bad as they are.
